What Have You Learned? / How Have You Progressed?

Nothing absolutely nothing..

 

Re: What Have You Learned? / How Have You Progress

what have i learned? that nearly every character is overpowered in their own right.

That anytime you play somebody and they just get cheesy wins, and you think, character XXX is lame. you don't even have to try to win. just do this flow chart over and over and you are going to win pretty easily, you are usually wrong. its tougher to win with nearly every character than it looks, even when in the hands of a spammer.

two exceptions--lei and pppp, wolf and dmp+k. well, maybe pai/lau whoring 1kk. but obviously, the ceiling is pretty low on all of those.

 

Re: What Have You Learned? / How Have You Progress

A lot..

 

Re: What Have You Learned? / How Have You Progress

Congrats! My best advise is, keep and never stop playing! =)

 

Re: What Have You Learned? / How Have You Progress

That's what separates us casual players from the true VF's and if someone cant deal with just DMPK then they are need to adapt a new strategy!

 

Re: What Have You Learned? / How Have You Progress

Call me crazy but the way i learn VF since i study and practice Jeet kune do, i was thought not to stick to one style of play. I try new characters and learn them all. The more i learn outside the box the more i can think like my opponent. I may get my ass kicked in VF but hey, its a huge learning experience. Thats why this is the best 3d fighter. Need to learn shun, i can't figure him out

 

Re: What Have You Learned? / How Have You Progress

Yah, Shun is hard to manage but I've seen many Shun players that are just playing it easy. Maybe in long time playing Shun, you'll be as good as them too.

 

Re: What Have You Learned? / How Have You Progress

I've learned that there's always something new to learn about VF.

Until you've learned ALL of the characters and mastered them equally there will ALWAYS be something new to learn. Here's to more years of enjoying this "old" game. Cheers!

Characters I am learning this year:

Shun, Lei and Akira.

 

Re: What Have You Learned? / How Have You Progress

Well good luck for that tonyfamilia, hope you'd master them all!

 

Re: What Have You Learned? / How Have You Progress

If anyone would ask me what have I learned in the past few weeks? I would say that you can only enjoy playing VF with specific people who strive to improve like yourself and they MUST have very strong mental stamina. Play with anyone else, win or lose.... it's just not fun!

I've played a lot of players lately that while they are good at the game they are also NOT good at the game, because they lack simple BASIC skills and mental stamina. After all the spamming is done, shenanigans is blocked and throws are escaped they have nothing to fall back on. Once you have taken away all of their options you can just exploit them with simple BASIC skills like guaranteed 's, elbows, etc here and there. Simple basic skills that many players CONSTANTLY over look and they wonder why they have hit a ceiling or are progressing so slowly.

Maybe I'm seeing or feeling things that are not there, but I've notice that my style of play tends to annoy people. I'm not a flashy player, I don't care to have a super offense but I can attack fairly well and have a pretty solid defense. If someone were to ask me where would I place myself in terms of offense and defense, I'd like to say I'm in the middle, but I definitely favor defense more. I guess that's because of my NYC roots and NYC players have always been about shutting down offense via defense.

IMO VF is all about adapting and the faster you can adapt the better you will be. Usually whoever adapts first will always come out on the winning end or have the longer winning streak at the end of a session. But to adapt well I think you need to have very strong BASIC skills, plus you need to take online play / lag into consideration.

Where am I going with this? For example;

1) If you block Jeffry's Knee Kick before you try to be fancy you should FIRST make your opponent aware that you know how to punish this move on defense. Normally a 14 frame move would punish Jeff's Knee Kick . So, if you are using Jacky for example you should punish by every time. I believe Knee is only -15 so you have to punish it very quickly and it has to be done on Jeffry's decent and not after he gets to the ground. If he is on the ground then you were way to slow and will get nothing. This is something a lot of players do and then call foul and blame it on lag or whatever bizarre excuse they can come up with in their head. When I see this happening I'll attack with or to interrupt because I see this as something I can use to my advantage. Of course if they punish correct a few times I would dear not doing anything except take defensive actions because they have made me AWARE that they know the rules of this game very well.

The reason you should be strong in basic skill is because it will keep your opponent honest and eliminate a lot of their spamming or abare against you. And if your opponent isn't doing any of those things then they are only doing one thing and that's most likely blocking. And once an opponent has been warned enough times that's when you can apply other tactics like throwing, half and full circulars if they favor ETEG's.


This is the basis of my style and I try to force this effect on people and it seems that when I apply it they often quit or play with this sort of ' I give up ' or ' I'm just not having fun ' play style. It reminds me of my high school days playing soccer where some of my teammates want to play boom ball during scrimmage. They just want to kick the ball back and forth across the field in the air seeing who can send it the farthest not realizing that they are not learning anything except how to kick the ball and as we know... anyone can kick a ball. Now when some of the other guys on the team who likes to play a more controlled ground based ball game and start doing that everyone is like this is boring and want to walk off the field.

2) if the 14 frame move is failing because of lag then FUCKING adapt. Use ! is 11 frames for most characters and 12 for anyone who doesn't fall in the 11 frame category. Again VF is all about adapting, so play smart and take the damage. Sure it's not the damage you wanted, but some damage is better than no damage. Plus now you have a +4 advantage and you can resort to mid launchers or some other mid attack that's not to slow that would crush anything your opponent does if they try to spam or abare.

There is more I want to add, but I'm out of time... gotta work!

 

Re: What Have You Learned? / How Have You Progress

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">2) if the 14 frame move is failing because of lag then FUCKING adapt. Use ! is 11 frames for most characters and 12 for anyone who doesn't fall in the 11 frame category. Again VF is all about adapting, so play smart and take the damage. Sure it's not the damage you wanted, but some damage is better than no damage. Plus now you have a +4 advantage and you can resort to mid launchers or some other mid attack that's not to slow that would crush anything your opponent does if they try to spam or abare. </div></div>

I know my ass has no place speaking after such a long absence, but the only negative to this is that it promotes bad habits for offline play. (not that most people play offline anymore ...)

 

Re: What Have You Learned? / How Have You Progress

Rodney I couldn't agree more, sad as that is. I love VF enough that I will still play almost anyone, but you're right when you say, "After all the spamming is done, shenanigans is blocked and throws are escaped they have nothing to fall back on," and this makes for very uninspiring matches.

Here's another one - how about people following through with their flowchart or canned crap when you've already been knocked down by the first hit?! There are also a lot of players, and even good ones, who just keep on attacking at disadvantage. I'm guilty of this to a degree, but man, there are some people that seem like once they've been hit by a couple nice setups, they just keep on pressing buttons (other than guard) just to hit you for the sake of landing something. Yikes, stupid! I know for sure this happens because I can feel it! What I mean by that is if you can pull off a setup/flowchart that just keeps on punishing them for practically the whole round, they then abandon all reasoning and just try to hit for the sake of hitting.

All right, I'm going to finally say something that I've been telling Air Jacky to say for years now, and this topic seems to be the perfect area to do so.

Air Jacky feels the exact same way we do about this topic. We often talk about many aspects of this very notion. For instance, if someone we don't recognize is right away getting out of throws, hit checking, fuzzy guarding, etc., it prompts us to instantly play our best. It also prompts the feeling of, "YES! This is fun!"

Unfortunately this isn't often the case, so here is what Air Jacky has been doing for a long time now, and the fact that HARDLY ANYONE has caught on is not only shocking, but really indicative of just how people may not understand this game.

Whenever he comes across the kind of opponent that we're talking about in this post, he tries to do many things leading up to something that won't let him win, whether it's never guarding, only throwing, constantly bitch slap kicking, or the worst and most obvious, hardly ever attacking, etc. What is sad is that it seems most people don't know that he is doing this. The way we know this to be true is that the same person will keep requesting rematches over and over, and even worse, still give a "good games" message afterward. It's true that he feels a little bad for doing this, but he's trying to prove a point, or at least make people aware of holes in their game. Unfortunately it's almost completely futile.

What we both tend to question is - are people wanting to keep playing as long as they're winning? I know for sure that is the mentality of some people he plays against. Especially when he makes it extremely obvious and the opponent requests about 20 to 30 rematches.

With very moderate or mediocre players I understand that they really might not realize it. That is fine. But when the opponent displays decent to good skill, come on! I believe there are many players that are right on the hump of progressing, I just can't figure out why they can't get passed it. I guess it is easier to learn flowcharts and canned combos instead of also honing in on the basics, because the basics in VF are definitely not easy, or at least being a master at them. Hell, I'm nowhere near a master at them, but realize when they are needed to win a match, or at least recognizing when to use them, i.e. when playing an opponent that knows them as well or better.

Something else amazing to me is the vast difference between Japanese and US players. Even when I play a very mediocre Japanese player, he still understands the basics better than most US players, and sometimes better than me. I wouldn't even have to look at the region with XBox to know if I was playing a Japanese person. It's evident almost instantly!

I don't want this post to be a downer. Quite the contrary, I hope it spurs people on to do better. With how few people are online there are many people that are thirsty for some fierce battles. So many players are, like I said, right on the verge of greatness! My advice to them - stop caring if you win just to win. The easiest way to do this is to not let yourself take the easy way out with abare or spamming.

All you're really doing then is hoping to win, not <span style="text-decoration: underline">planning to win!</span>

 

Re: What Have You Learned? / How Have You Progress

Such a good thread. Air Jacky has an interesting outlook on things, for sure. I feel inspired to play again.

 

Re: What Have You Learned? / How Have You Progress

I been caught on to that Weak shit he does everytime he joins my games.... He ain't fooling no one because first off he Does'nt present a challenge to me to even show me what holes my game has. Second i stomp him when he is down to show him i know what he is doing when he try to prove his point. Whether he's attacking with somersaults a mile away just to be a asshole i been caught on to that and try new combo's on him. Whats funny is My girl be watching me while im explaining what he's doing. The funniest shit though with Air Jacky watching him perform the Iageri kick all fuck up and disoriented LMAO!! The only reason i stick around is because no one else is there to play. Even when i happen to lose from doing the same shit he does i still stick around.

@Rodnutz.. People never have fun when theyare been punsihed for doing the wrong thing. DiggeryDoo is guilty of this. He did'nt want to play me anymore cause he said i Punish TOO much and its not fun. Oh well.


Long live VF.

 

Re: What Have You Learned? / How Have You Progress

100% Agree with SDS, for me Air Jacky is the weakest Jacky I've probably ever faced online and I enjoyed humiliating him.

Considering how your 30 folds better, I'm surprised how highly you talk of him JHow. To say that many people don't understand the game but Air Jacky is trying to enlighten them is very insulting to me.

 

Re: What Have You Learned? / How Have You Progress

That's just it Kamais, he is 100% on the level. Heck, he even beat more of the famous Japanese players during the VF3TB days than I did. If you truly feel he is the weakest Jacky you've played, then unfortunately he wasn't giving you his best. I'm definitely not making excuses for him, because we all deserve everyone's best. What I will say is that Air Jacky feels the same way about player match that I do. And while I know it's beating a dead horse for rank matches until the next VF comes out, player match just isn't the same. Even for me, "my best" is usually only until the 5th to 10th match, unless I'm playing someone that is, or can, kick my ass until there's no tomorrow repeatedly. But even then I wonder if the person kicking my ass is even having fun or giving me their best due to my inability against them. Maybe it's passive aggressive behavior on Air Jacky's part, but there is a point to it. Why would anyone want to keep playing someone that is getting beat down profusely? And to further that question, if someone can't determine or has no clue that their opponent is completely messing around, doesn't that say something about that person's understanding of the game?

If this behavior is demeaning or insulting to anyone, I would suggest slightly taking it with a grain of salt. I would say it's more so the dull factor of an old game and Air Jacky's yurning for a true Japanese match, which there is nothing wrong with hoping for a truly epic fight! I know for sure that if arcades ceased to exist in Japan, and all the Japanese had was XBox, rank match would be about 90% of what they played.

Lastly, any comment that has ever been said on VFDC about nitpicking a player's style, abare, dumb/annoying tactics, stupidity... I think we've all felt that or at least definitely experienced it. And the net result is the same, we usually choose to not endure a ton of matches with that person. Now he might be holding his standards higher than most, but at the same time I wonder how someone could request so many rematches with him when it should be obvious that something is up. This is absolutely indicative of people's desire only to win and/or lack of understanding of the game.

 

Re: What Have You Learned? / How Have You Progress

All I got to say is player matches is for non-japanese players who want to suck at VF5
Really player matches SUCK no one cares about playing at a high fucking level anymore. and if you think people are still playing at a high level on player match then you really dont understand what this game is all about. again player matches are for practicing and USA has been practicing for over a year and for what to still SUCK at VF5.
At least with Rank you have something to fight for, everyone plays harder, you have a reason for learning and to improve one self.
there was a lot of complaining about being beat by low punch or DPK in rank. that means that person is at least doing what ever it takes to win and i love those fights, and hell if he or she wins that way good for them. I at least got his or her best, Thats all i care about. And if someone can beat you over and over and with that lame shit, and then make you complain about in on the web, sounds like you need to practice another 3 years LOL.
i have always said if you want my Best play me in rank, then i know i am getting your best. SIMPLE, oh right you wont have a excuse for losing if you play on Rank.
When TWP sent me a message saying i should play this game more like checkers and less like chess, i was stupefied by this, why would anyone want to play a kids type game when we can play a high level chess like match. after that i stopped caring about Player match. just doesn't get me excited. only when i play high level players do i care, the ones that care about their opponents level that they bring to the game. Most of you dont care about that anymore. i would rather have 5 games in 20 mins that are rank then 2 hrs playing one person over and over again in Player match. I will always take quality over quantity.
i get a kick out of how i can do 10 - 15 or more throw escapes in 10 matches but lose all 10 lol. right there that should throw up some flags but most of you are just attacking and not even paying attention to what is really going on. only caring that you won no matter how lame the match is Really VF has been dead for over 2 years now.
And really US dosent deserve VF5FS with the level of play out there and how most can't handle a loses.
and then you get lame ass like happy friend who will only play an opponent if he is wining if he loses 2 of more in a row he quits and makes an excuse why he lost (u can also add stlouis guy too) so i win a couple of rounds and and then i let them win they enjoy it, really thats all that matters to them, that they got their win. so i give it to them I even wrap up the win and put a bow ribbon on the top for them.

If Japan all of sudden had no VF5FS and just VF5 xbox most would be playing rank for COMPETITION.

player match is like a watered down version of VF

Hell even if a few of you want to meet for some rank matches a couple times a week i would be up for thatBut i am not holding my breath.
come on and Bring it ON.

if you want to flame, flame AWAY, But i am really hoping to get people thinking about VF's competition.

ps kamais O baka - dude thats all i need to say about u. LOL keep practicing lol

 

Re: What Have You Learned? / How Have You Progress

Alright, I get what your saying. Don't you think your over-thinking it too much though? You do realize that games are so hard to find that there's pretty much no choice but to keep on requesting a re-match. Also, for me personally when beating certain people over and over again it gives a big healthy dosage to my ego.

You say that people's desire is to only win judging from the fact that they keep on requesting re-matches with Air Jacky. What else could it be? Air Jacky's being an ass and giving 20% of his skills according to you so are people supposed to play him with the intent of learning? There's nothing to learn because he's not playing to his potential and he gets his ass kicked left and right so yeah, I go for the W against him.

EDIT: Oh, and don't give me the BS statistics of his accomplishments 15 years ago or w/e in VF3TB days, how the hell is that relevant to now man? I'm dumbfounded why someone of your skill (and smarts) is so attached to ass jacky, your better then that.

 

Re: What Have You Learned? / How Have You Progress

Call me baka all you want but I'll agree with you on a few things:
1. Yes VF is dead now.
2. Yes, Happyfriend is retarded.
3. Yes, Kaminari is a little angry nerd.
4. I can agree with your sentiments regarding ranked.

I wonder why you spend so much time in players match though when you bash it so, nothing but air in your head bro?