VF5 Ver.C Goh Command List

I think Goh's Kumiteharai P+K is incorrectly classified in the command list. It is no sabaki but an inashi. Sabakis are <u>attacks</u> (see Goh's 3P+K) that hit and damage the opponent even if the parry didn't connect. Inashis don't do that because they are simply <u>moves</u> with deflection properties if they connect, or a whiff animation (at best) if they don't.

Now, Goh's Kumiteharai P+K move doesn't hit the opponent in any way.

 

Hm.

 

Ok, what is Inashi then (What difference between Kumite-harai as Sabaki and Aoi's 4P+K+G as Inashi? -I don't get it, and fully agree with Leonard)?

 

Thanks, Myke, for taking the time to elaborate more on that. I think the description in the glossary (that I was referring to) is a bit misleading for it's a bit imprecise. Your clarification, though, was completely enlightening.

 

so /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif + /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif is not a sabaki but an inashi ?

 

LOL - a classic.

Nope, 3P+K is a sabaki. It even animates (and hits) if the sabaki doesn't connect to a parry.

 

Ive not heard the term "inashi" used in a long time...

 

- /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif crouch stagger
- /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif crouch stagger

- /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif slam / flop on hit and counter

- Wallbreak mentioned in /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif; /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/f.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif; /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/f.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif + /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif, /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif

- Also old "slam on recovery counter hit" on /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/b.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/f.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif although it slams on any hit anyway

- /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/db.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif Old "Low throw guaranteed on MC" text. Not sure if this is really necessary or in union (or something) with the other datas since there's usually no mention of guaranteed throw on +12 moves. As far as I know you even have to do dash 0-frame throw to make this one work anyway.

- /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif + /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif +13 on sabaki (I think)

- /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d_.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/f.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif + /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif does not have super replay
- BT /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif + /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif has super replay
- /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/b.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/f.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif super replay on sabaki only

- BT /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif + /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/g.gif on hit "down"

- Again old info in notes section: /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif + /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif sabaki definately does not give +11 - +25. It's barely possible to get /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/b.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/f.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif to hit afterwards and I couldn't get /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/f.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif to hit so +14 should be the best possible advantage (like it says in the "guard" column. Possibly could add a "+" in front of it to clear it up).

- /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/b.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/f.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif + /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/g.gif has "0" and "down" in wrong columns

 

I think the advantage depends on the stance here. Open stance allows for a throw (with a dash-in), closed only for a punch startup.

 

Both stances allow a dash-in for a 0-frame throw.

 

You get guaranteed 0-frame throw from both and then there's the old stance specific sabaki -> throw without delays, but the advantage should be the same for both (and I would think it would be the old Evo +13 since there has been no reason to change it).

 

I just noticed that in Goh's tsukami section there are small between each arrow So i thought i'd bump Combolammas list of additions by asking if that's done on purpose.

PS: I also noticed that i when i meantioned "head stagger" in my last post akai understood i meant "head crumple"

PS#2: And i also realized that i'm probably to blame for unclear differentiation between sabaki and inashi in the glossary

 

As far as I recall, for those more elaborate Tsukami Grabs with two directions, you have to return the stick to neutral after the first input before registering a second direction to pull off the more damaging Tsukami Grab throws.