VF5 Akira Thread

More info... played a little more. Luckily one of the players actually explained some changes to Akira that I didn't know. I have a vid of doing random things against him. Just got to find a place to host it.

Anyway, SDE is not throw counterable anymore (again). That was probably the biggest surprise to me. Time to spam the elbows!

+ or : The last isn't counterable. I'm guessing the frames are close to SDE or better since it's a high attack.

I think everybody knows that shoulder ram staggers the opponent like Goh's. However, it seems that on counter or most likely side hit, it produces a weird stomach stun. Looks like there might be guaranteed followups on this stun. I'll have to try to do it again to see.

+ or side hit throw will not cause a wall stun, but it will leave the opponent pretty much right next to you rather than at mid range in normal circumstances. Good way to force the opponent toward the wall. Should be able to pressure with some serious nitaku in that case too.

That's about it for now.

 

Thanks for the additional input /versus/images/graemlins/grin.gif it's really appreciated!

I'm really looking forward to the stuff off of +or If I remember correctly you can delay some of the hits too, but I'm not too sure... i hope it is true! And I'm glad to know that the SDE isn't throw counterable, but I guess that might have to do with the new throw qualities... It seems like lots of things are no longer throw counterable.

As far as that weird stomach stun you mentioned, I think what you got is a side crumble... it should be accompanied by a blue flash as well, if I'm not mistaken. Off of that, > is guaranteed on most, if not all, weight classes, so enjoy the damage~

One great use of +or is that you can get yourself a side crumple as mentioned above, as it turns the opponent to his side (which you may have noticed). It presents a pretty dangerous nitaku situation and HIGHLY discourages aggression on the defender's part. It might also be easier to OM around your opponent after the throw and score some other sick combos... but these are mostly guesses, as I haven't played the game yet. It might be worth testing out though

Thanks again, and do keep us posted!

 

Maddy: IMO you're right, they should give better reward for TE. It doesn't seem to fit if you look at what kind of reward you get for guarding things. I think TE against big damage throws should give better reward, but then again, I think there's a balance that's in place by putting the best throws in the common directions (IE everyone breaks against Kage in an mC situation).

 

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I've been an advocate of the idea that the better a throw is the riskier it should be when escaped. For example, for Kage, they could change TFT to -10 on escape and his neutral throw to -3 on escape.

I think that'd follow the basic concept of risk and reward more. Any other thoughts from anyone?

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In VF3 they had this concept--there were certain throws that had a guaranteed counter when escaped. In VF4, they took out this concept and made none of the throw escapes counterable. IMO I like the VF4 system better because if risk is too closely aligned with reward then that makes guessing/using throws more random.

In other words, in rocks-papers-scissors you have no idea what the other guy is going to go for the first time around because all the options are all worth the same in terms of risk-reward. So the best strategy for both sides is to completely randomize. However, if say rocks could beat both scissors and other rocks (for the other player only) then you know the opponent is more likely to go for rocks. And thus the guessing game begins.

This may be purely psychological, but I think it's more "fun" when certain throws are clearly better than others because if they are all worth the same then it's best to randomize. To some degree this concept also applies to attacks, although less so because there are so many variables as to what makes an attack good or bad that it is the circumstances of the situation that would dictate which move you should use.

Hmmm I think I just wrote a very confusing post.

P.S. In VF5 I think it was taken even further--throw escapes leave both players even advantage! I'm guessing this is to further incentivize going for throws.

 

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In VF4, they took out this concept and made none of the throw escapes counterable.

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Sorry Jeff, just want to point out that Lion's and Akira's throws leave them vulnerable to guaranteed attacks. (ex: Jacky's

 

If you escape Lion's face scratching throw, Lion is forced to struggle to recoup. Hrmm.

 

Oh yeah! I forgot about those two.

 

I've actually been curious about approaching throw differentiation from the other end, varying their exe times by a frame or two. One could argue that this is already sort of in place by the extra time necessary to pull out, say, an unbuffered HCF throw, but this would make certain throws a greater threat at smaller disadvantage and better parallel the game for striking.

 

/versus/images/graemlins/shocked.gif

FN_01171

at 1:48, Player 2 uses ++ followed by + which combos (as in, when looking at the life bar, the damage from the + and the damage from the + add on to eachother with no separation between the two) and causes a back crumple. While Player 2 combos no further, I have no doubt that > would combo just fine, resulting in SICK damage.

I'm by no means an expert Akira player, nor can I be certain that this isn't a fluke. Any input on this?

 

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Any input on this?

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Yeah. I can't dl this on the company computer, but it sounds fucked up...and if the body check recovers in time for a combo then it is ouch time. AFAIK in evo you can only get hits after a body check when the body check produces a bounce of the wall from medium distance. Ending a match with evade>CH bodycheck>wall>body check is the coolest thing I've ever done in any video game. This includes saving the princess & the galaxy/versus/images/graemlins/cool.gif

 

Akira can do + -> or + -> . It's an evil evil combo, the damage isnt that bad but it looks vicious. I'm not sure if you can replace the with -> but I've never seen it.

Namflow

 

You're quite right. I was so in awe of the back crumple that I didn't even realize how ridiculously long the recovery was on +.

Akira, at best, gets a guaranteed down punch. Thanks for setting the record straight, sorry about that~! /versus/images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

I think Namflow means that after the ++, /++, ++, Akira can do + to the back crumpled oppt. I saw this in a clip, and yeah, the damage wasn't too bad.

the combo as Namflow lists it can be done in all versions of VF4.

bryan

 

You saw it in a clip? Do you remember which one? I'd like to see it!

I think the reason why the recovery looked so horrible in the other video is because he didn't press anything after the + and just let the recovery animation play out all the way. There's no other way to explain it. He might be able to do to combo the opponent, but if that's what he needs to hit then I doubt that > would combo the opponent, as those double kicks have what it takes with their low hit detection. Now, if a can reach an opponent after +, /+, it would surely cause a back crumple and give him enough time for the "brain-dead-easy" bounce combo. Boy, I love speculation :B

s_aki: the difference between VF5 and the other ones is that Akira's bodycheck never caused a crumple. I think that once people really start getting the hang of OM, people will forego the canned /, and an Akira player's choice would definitely be + due to its immense damage potential (assuming it's still there in this version). Just picture this: OM > + (side/back crumple) > = about half life. OUCH.

 

You're right akiralove, I didn't realize I typed in the combo wrong. What I meant to say was:

+ -> /+ -> + ->

So Akira pulls you in, does a reverse bodycheck, then a normal body check to the opponets back that gets a crumble, and then a double jumping kick.

 

That's wild. Having not seen the combo in question, does it look like could be substituted for the ? Just curious.

 

I've seen that combo. It looked like a legit one but didn't do much damage. I guess it's a easy version of SDE, dbl palm for someone who can't buffer dbl palm very well.

I think you can replace DJK with AS3 and do a bit more damage if not techrolled at the end. 2_4P,P wouldn't seem like to hit and nor does DLC.


Among what I've seen, the combo that suprised me the most was 214P, 43P, dbl palm. It takes about 40% of the lifebar, and it's easy to do. If this damage doesn't get nerfed in the following revisions, using 214P in VF5 would have quite a meaning due to its damage potential as either a opposite nitaku or a delayed attack.

 

Yea Maddy you're totally right, the damage for -> -> is insane, plus the combo is so easy even I can do it! /versus/images/graemlins/smile.gif It reminds me of VF4 Version B (the north american release) where akira could do -> | (dodge) -> + for close to half life damage. And I thought those days were over...

 

You are right, Namflow. The exact combo in Ver.B went through my mind when I saw that combo. I remember watching Ohsu goes for 214P then evade DBC for over half life. Ohsu used to do that a lot! Is 214P still -6 in VF5 like it was in FT?